In this episode, we are talking with Sebastian about iPaaS, process automation and cloud automation. Sebastian started his company, We Make Future just a couple of years ago and grow organically over the last years. With his company, he really wants to help companies to rid of manual and inefficient processes.
This episode also highlights the ups and downs of being an entrepreneur and why the German market is sometimes far behind when it comes to digitalization and automation.
Sebastian is using the following low code tools:
Links for WeMakeFuture:
If you have feedback or ideas on which topics need to be covered at this podcast - you are more than welcome to get in touch with me.
You can find more information on www.lowcode-founders.com, or you can drop me a message at sarah@biberei.de
Enjoy and keep on building new digital products.
Sarah
Speaker Sarah
Hello everyone today we have a new guest with us. It is Sebastian. Sebastian is the owner of a company called We Make Future and I'm very happy to have him here today, as we will learn what term integration platform as a service actually means and why it is so important.
Speaker Sebastian
Hello Sarah, thank you for being here.
Speaker Sarah
All right Sebastian, can you please introduce yourself to the audience and tell us a little bit more about your current company and your position?
Speaker Sebastian
Yeah sure definitely. Well as you know I'm Sebastian a founder of we make future and what about myself I love cooking a I do a lot of sports and I like being in the nature but also really really enjoy IT. And creating scenario automation and process automation and this is why also we found We Make future.
Speaker Sarah
Okay so how did you come up with the idea of founding we make future. What what do you actually deliver as a company?
Speaker Sebastian
That's a really good question I think um regarding the automation market there has been in the last decade only RPA . As a driver of automation value to organizational processes and to business process automation but well as we all know software service is encountering the world we no longer own things and since we don't own servers and since we're only using cloud based software more and more lately if there is a shift to a Platform based automation and as you said in the iPaaS. The service helps you to integrate these APIs and when you integrate APIs with a lot of APIs you can automate that. And when we found that the company realized well there's nobody in europe really professionalizing this approach. There are like freelancers, there are some technical providers that use for their services integration platforms but no one delivers like a wide amount of automation possibilities over the usage of APIs. And this is why we started we make future.
Speaker Sarah
So your idea sounds really obvious so the idea of having different cloud services and combining them with APIs and optimizing this. So why do you think hasn't been more comapnies before you started your own one?
Speaker Sebastian
That's a good question because there are a lot of things we encountered when we started the company. Um It is actually hard to be one of the first was with a really wide scope because we automate from coaching to IT Services to e-Commerce to our real estate to like every service industry because we say we automate service industries. This is pretty hard and we also took a step back and we focus and I think there are like a lot of performance agencies. There are a lot of web agencies or like marketing agencies using these tools already but they don't use it for the actual purpose. They use it for just helping them and their specific niche but they're not using it for the automation potential it has. So there was of course because they have a running business model no need for them to actually say hey we only focus on automation and we try to do that because we saw there are a lot of our RPA Providers but they are not focusing on app automation. And I've seen software that got automated by an RPA. Which had an API and that's really sad to see. So this is why we think these are P. A. Providers focused on their technology and other users of the current technology didn't really encounter the potential of an automation market.
Speaker Sarah
All right so um as from what I hear and what I see your decision was very successful. So what did you do before you started the company? And when did you start at the company?
Speaker Sebastian
Yeah we started off in 2019. Um And like every startup it went good and bad and went bad and good and good and bad. Um And now we are reconfiguring and rechanging things again in the start up. Um And what I did before is well I was at a consultancy and I was like three days there and I was like okay that's not what I want to do. Um And I did it for like half year. Um And we have been in touch like our P. A. And a lot of automation like Zapier automation mostly and learning automation. But like really old school approach and after half a year there was still no technology provided and like really typical consultancy work and um therefore before I was uh this consultancy job I was banking and I like learning automation process automation. And a lot about like how to get a digitalization shift into an organization. Um And yeah this got me to the point where I think like a really somebody needs to focus only on automation and this is why we started also make future and this is where my work experience adds up.
Speaker Sarah
So does your experience help you currently because you were at the custody at the customer side. So how can you make benefit from your working experience you had before?
Speaker Sebastian
Um Well there are several things where it can benefit of is for example when it comes to regulation because I was at a bank. Um I really understand regulation quite well. I can help people to implement GDPR compliance automation between cloud automation services. Um We can help to get things um bulletproof for like an ISO process and many of these things where people like give us requirements and we can make things fitting to requirements also from the consultancy job, there was like really okay, try to get the customer involve trying to give try to get many stakeholders involved and this helped me of course in organizing and structuring uh the startup and the current projects,
Speaker Sarah
So you know, both sides, so being an entrepreneur but also being employed at the company. Could you ever imagine going back to a situation where you are no longer an entrepreneur?
Speaker Sebastian
It depends on the position I think um if I for example have like a research or of like senior consultant, zero manager role of course, if there's like Freedom to create and to really do things and make things happen. Um of course there's like I was actually quitting the bank when they offered me a different position and the position I I had the chance to create things. Um so for a state and I really love this. Um and this is why I will definitely like in 10 or 15 years not be uh like startup phone or anymore, we'll also start up, it's not start up then anymore, but I will not be uh probably working at we make future because I always think there are so many things in life I want to do and right now at this automation and maybe in 10 years it's something else. And so it might be that I'm employed back then. I don't know, I'm really open for that, I just want to do it and I want to make a crate for now and then we'll see.
Speaker Sarah
All right. So you said doing your founding of your company, There were a lot of good times and bad times. So what was the biggest challenge you experienced while you were starting your company?
Speaker Sebastian
We're starting it with three people and our vision was two to spare. We didn't really focus on one thing we did in the beginning, and we were three founders. One was working at consultancy still, and we were finding the idea was cross findings in the cash flow of the consultancy into product development and to productizing services that worked till my other co founder um just said, no, I don't want to be anymore in the company. I had several private reasons. So he stepped out of the company and she said, yeah, well, you know, I got a big good job offer, I'm out too, and I was like, okay, yeah, cool, I'm alone now. and um yeah, so it was like in November 2019 uh, when I just thought, okay, fuck it, I'm going to to brazil for a month and I was in brazil for a month and I was okay, what do I do? Like, we have signed client contracts and I said to the client, okay, we can do the contract. Um but I'm not sure what the future will exist. And then it was actually like 14 months ago, like in February 2000 when it really kicked off. It was like insane from there. We're really growing organically and we're right now like slowing a bit across down because we really need to focus on some organizational changes and structuring things or else we will just grow and explode. So as you can like see it was like a bumpy ride and still today we, we have a lot of bumpy rights like things with the employees, but we have like really happy employees of things. They have like a lot of freedom and decision what they want to do and how they want to do things and where they work when they work. Um but also there's like this whole bureaucracy thing and also these um like financial things you have to do, isn't it?
Speaker Sarah
You have 10 employees, right?
Speaker Sebastian
So so
Speaker Sarah
You basically grow from from 3 to 1 to 10. But I think that's, that's where we were amazing by the way, so having this, this organic growth, It's I think pretty cool. So you said you, it's been kicked off in February 2020, was that kind kind of clients are approaching you and saying, Hey, I definitely need you because identified this in this problem or is it more the case that you have to show to the customers. Hey, you might might need me, maybe you don't know it yet, but you definitely need me in the future.
Speaker Sebastian
Uh well the beginning we tried to be a missionary to convince people and automation is amazing. Um and we try that every now and then and realize the german market is not there yet. Um because we are mostly focusing on the german market. We are right now doing our first internationalization steps. Um but The German market is not there. If I tell people, yeah, you can automate that and you need this, then they're like, Oh no, it costs me 10 years a month. Like yeah. And you say 500 and employee time. Um they, they're not in cloud apps. So um we changed the approach of telling people, hey, you can automate that RP for our P. A providers, it's easy to do it because they can just go there and say like, hey keep your stack, you don't need to change the better technology. Can you creep? You're bad technology. Um, so they can directly address and convince people and automating things. We cannot because we need the right infrastructure and since people are not aware of their own infrastructure most of the time, um and we cannot go out there and try like lucky shot troops on the right infrastructure, it doesn't work. So when we focus on this, we really focus on bringing warm leads and really um like early early stage users like pioneers through classical marketing period. I think it's like a lot of pioneer users which are right now our clients.
Speaker Sarah
Okay, let's let's take this idea for a moment that german customers maybe do not realize how big the potential is because in our last podcast session we talked about the Mittelstand and its digitalization of the Mittelstand and Can was here with me. He told the exact same thing as you did that and I experienced the same and the phrase you said that maybe the german market is not there yet. I often have this phrase in my mind with our services of low code and low code software development. So why do you think this is the case? Why are we Germans in some cases some far behind when it comes to cloud technology and to the openness of optimization?
Speaker Sebastian
Why are we german so far behind? There are many things I think um for example if we just regard the fiber connections in Germany well we have one of the worst fiber connections because of lobby is um in the nineties I think young boom on monday, the really funny video about it. Um we have the problem with the mobile phone connection because of lobby is um because telephone providers doesn't want to share their uh connection towers with each other. Well, but this is not only reason it's also a cultural thing. Um we also we always want to do things want to personally. Perfect. But That's not how you approach things nowadays you do it 80 20. You check if it's going to work or not. If it's not going to work then Skip The 80% you did and just don't do it anymore. And if you realize okay yeah well it's working quite good then you can try to do like 15% of the last 20 persons you were like left off and then you can check okay doesn't turn like millions. And if so then um yeah you can definitely build it out and really create something something out of it. Um But Germans really tend to to perfection eyes everything and I believe that there's also the fear of regulation because of GDP R. I hear it so often that my data needs to be in Germany and I'm like okay no like if somebody, if a client tells me to call my data needs to be in Germany I tell them okay if you say that again I'm gonna hung up because it's not true. There are some some niches like military services like Social Security where yes you have to have your data. Okay. Got that. But if you are a marketing company, okay I'm not gonna do law consultancy but I'm out and when it comes to these points I really don't care if people understand where they are in because if I spend time on that they don't pay it. So. No we're out we just focus on the leaders of technology and if they are good if they understand that they need automation. Okay, here we go.
Speaker Sarah
You said so many valuable points and I can only agree you have no idea how often I was in any kind of presentation whether it was in my current role as an entrepreneur but also my previous world where I developed software for the last 5 to 6 years and the first question I always got no matter what I presented, no matter which project represented as what about data privacy, how have you ensured that my a non confidential data is secured so that no one on Earth can ever have access to it. And I I also see the fear that many, many companies and you said that I think that the data must be stored in Germany and they're not allowed to use. I also heard that they're not allowed to use any american companies and I think if you're not if you're not from Germany and I had this discussion with another podcast and if you guessed he didn't ask me then you're you have a really tough time developing software because most of the stuff from from american companies.
Speaker Sebastian
I totally agree because what I see is for example yesterday and this is also a typical german thing, a friend of mine told me that he is not allowed to use wifi, he's using wifi we p a to pressure key. The chance to hack that thing. Yes we're not talking about quantum computing. We're talking about someone sitting at home and hacking that thing is pretty pretty unlikeable. It's technically yes possible to hack it somehow. But they're not allowed to use WIFI and come on. It's like it's a like a risk regarding thing and this is typical german if it comes up with like 0.1 person risk they avoid it. They say no it's not allowed to use it but that's that that's not good. That's not right. Do the risk go into the risk, do the risk thing.
Speaker Sarah
Yeah but but I think this would change if if more entrepreneurs like us will encounter the word and hopefully many people will listen to this podcast and then think about it. Um So you already mentioned some some words about your typical clients. So what kind of clients are typical and maybe you can give some more concrete use cases so that the audience can have a better idea what you actually are providing to the clients.
Speaker Sebastian
Okay well what are we providing? Um we're providing first of all to get like understanding of the processes, like a process analysis. Okay, what do you want to achieve? What is your goal. Sometimes it is really small things sometimes are like really crazy automation and what we try is then first of all to understand it for example like when we end our coal half an hour later I have one of these colds where we first structure it and write down the items we want to build and then we automate them. Um And what we provide is like the best service because we we have like our five internal developers but also we have really good and create community of like the best of the world for example an entire armada disappear and also in part automate and eight and all these tools which are coming up right now, we're really trying to connect with the best freelancers in the past developers in these um like automation software tools and there we connect the best one with the best project and sometimes content and that's okay if they say like no I want like a future Developer or if we say like hey is it okay if we managed it 50% and then we outsource it partly. Um and we're pretty fair in that we give like external prices directly to declined and um so we're sometimes cheaper than five or or upward but we're not doing things over the price. Um We offer and this is our role the best standardized herbal process automation approach with the highest quality. We've built our own software and our own software standards into the automation platforms to make it really scalable and to make it really rock solid. And what we've done in the last year of uh like really structuring it. I let's say one of these software providers said to me in a slack channel. That's crazy what you built their our Q and A. Was really impressed and we didn't ask for that. This was like out of nowhere. He just wrote it to us. That was pretty cool. So is what we mostly doing or building really good animations.
Speaker Sarah
I guess they're, your clients need to have cloud software or any kind of software they can use for the optimization. What can you suggest to the clients if they are currently in the situation where they are, they're using new technology for their businesses. What are the must have for the software selection so that they can use your services afterwards to have the best optimization?
Speaker Sebastian
Yeah, I got it. Um they need to check if there's an REST API and this is also what I tell people in every call when they say like, yeah, we are not there yet. And we were thinking about implementing lately. I had software. This was like locally installed. It's pretty good Telephone software tell them like, yeah, you do everything with it. And you wonder why you have to download everything every day or like exported and then upload it into google drive it doesn't have a rest api you need a rest api please go for suffer that has a rest api and if it has a rest api it's automate Herbal most of the times. Sometimes unhappy lax and points and it's not that flexible. Sometimes it has bad really bad documentation. For example we had something where the description Was only 100 characters and it is a support ticket tool a support ticket to with 100 check characters and the description isn't that good. So if they want to automate later on they can just send us the documentation of the API. And we will check if it works. If it works then you can automate it.
Speaker Sarah
Okay so from from what you explained um you're not only like putting the little pieces of technology together but while they're giving also a business consultation when you process design and and also the selection after towards and I think this is a very important point to mention because I think that the service providers and also the IT. Service providers must more come into a position where not only the technology is being served and not only the software development is being done but also consulted your clients when it comes to business decisions and I think this is a very important point.
So when a company now has the right tools and they are really, really keen to start an organization process, what do you think is the right the priority process? They should study to start off the authorization journey.
Speaker Sebastian
They should study to start off the authorization journey. And the first process they should do is they should really think about what is our most vulnerable process. For example if you are an agency or an HR Agency and you hire a lot of people and you need to write them emails to get their CVS and then upload the CVS etcetera etcetera. Um you can definitely elevate that but it's really really valuable process because it is declined connection process where you get the CV. And you need to think about what are my most important processes and then you need to figure out. Okay. Are they standardized herbal? Are they repeatable? And if there are repeatable, how often do they repeat? So if they are like for let's say 10 worry ations. And I do this 40 times a week And it is always taking me 10 minutes. Okay. That's a lot of time. You say that it's automate herbal and there are so many things for for example in um private economy especially at bigger organizations. Right. Think. Okay. That's totally automate herbal. Um and it won't be our P. A. Because our P. A. To do this job RP is too expensive. But cloud automation will do it. And I think that in the next decade we will see a shift there because if Germany or especially Europe doesn't do the shift into cloud and into cloud automation of I think we will technically be not relevant in the next 10 years.
Speaker Sarah
Yeah. Yeah, I absolutely agree. Have you ever had a situation where you, you draw your process improvements, you said here, that's that's what we can do. That's the time. You can say you can do better processes and then for whatever reasons the client says, no, I'm not going to do it because maybe the fear of the employees because every time you're automating something that youwould use or maybe there's someone who was actually employed for during this task. And now companies like you're showing them, hey, you maybe are not going to do your work anymore. So if you have experienced that?
Speaker Sebastian
Yes, we have um actually we found out that people try to work against this because they, even if a process of standardized people sometimes tend to not like standardization, um I sometimes believe automation, something like a dictatorship, You just say, okay, you do it now this way and there's only this way, there's no left or right because of this program this way, you cannot do it left or right. If you do it left or right, it won't work and you have to follow this path. So when employees don't do this, it fails and sometimes they do that, the intention, so it fails and they can do it by hand. And this is interesting because every client says no, I don't need change management. I'm like, okay, yeah, cool. Then hopefully energy yourself.
Speaker Sarah
So what what are you going to do then? Are you gonna tell your clients up front? Hey, you might want to, you want to give some thoughts about change management or do you do you give some some
Speaker Sebastian
It totally depends on the project. Um if it's a tiny project where you just really have to all of my process where you come from a technical perspective, um it's okay. It works. If it is a big organizational process for many stakeholders included, you have to do change management and you have to tell them okay. The process now goes this way, do you think it's okay? Do you want to um really do it? Sit
Speaker Sarah
And we now talked about a lot of technologies and stuff like that. So what are your favorite no code and local tools is this because because local drowned. Yeah.
Speaker Sebastian
Well my favorite tools are air table and Integromat being honest. I think that here is cool and superior is of course really powerful and helps people to get into automation. But if you want to really run scaled automation ins I think Zapier has limitations in the API endpoints for example, Shopify. Shopify app of entitlement. It has nearly all api endpoints and if it doesn't have an api endpoint you can make an API call. So and I think making an api call it's still something a no code or low code founder can do because uh it's maybe half an hour of thinking about it and you don't need to brock rem medically learn coding so that's okay. Um And superior has there a lot of limits? So yeah, I would say it like Integromat, Airtable, Zappier and like this order um when it comes to other tools, I really love Webflow. A really love shot before. I I think like stagger and software for our table are amazing tools um which we don't use our like tools like bubble and like app builders because we were mostly focus on process automation. Um and therefore the maximum we have is just a front end and in web flow or software for example.
Speaker Sarah
And is there a current tool you are missing? So it's true. We could think of how if this will be available maybe?
Speaker Sebastian
Yeah, there are the problem in um in automation or general and software but in software it is more doable and software you can write a test script, you can test it. There are also frameworks and tools that allow you to test your code and run all the worry ations and all the like possible things years you're gonna run into in cloud automation, especially integration platforms, services. You most of the time you don't have a test environment, you run on the real backbone of the business And this can be really, really painful. Um so for example we client that sent to himself 6000 emails, his email, his email inbox was a nightmare um and therefore a testing tool would be amazing and the testing tool doesn't mean you just click test run and then you go for example, this is for example pretty good. They have like test data and they're sometimes it's smoked that accurate but it's still really good. Um but the testing tool for automation, if somebody says like I have an idea how to do testing tool for automation, I would Really invests the money there because it's going to be a really big thing in the next 15 years because a lot of automation will be billed and you need to test them.
Speaker Sarah
Okay. So everyone in the audience, you know, heard that.
Speaker Sarah
Absolutely absolutely. So uh some last questions about your team organization because what I think is very interesting us being a german entrepreneur and running a german company, your whole team is working remotely and you also explained that you're working a lot were of external influences. So when you think about it, what are the the benefits and challenges you see with your organizational structure?
Speaker Sebastian
Mm That's a good question. Okay, challenges are we grow too fast. Um We need to slow it a little bit down because otherwise we also have financial risks of course. Um but we have to get the people on board, we have to talk with them and we have to get the structures and the knowledge and our standards and our like a well used uh for automation, Like really just technical work, much team Williams um into their minds and we need to convince them that automation um the way we build it is a different approach than you you can do, like on fiber or if you can do it on upward, um because we're really trying to do something rock solid and we want to build a long lasting line relationship. Yeah. And the organizational structure right now, half is we are splitting things up into teams a bit more. Um We have heart technology splits. Okay, so like if we do things with freelancers, they don't work on clients accounts and we have a lot of security measurements so things can go bad. Um and also our gpr compliant. So, and we have test data, test accounts and a lot of these things. Um yeah, so this is how we approach it in our organization.
Speaker Sebastian
And did you ever thought about going back to the normal standard of having an office where everyone is in the office located and and
Speaker Sarah
Yeah, I don't want to, but I think seeing us once or twice a month could be, could be worth it because what we experience is sometimes a little lack of communication. Um we try to solve it with time boxing that we circle like hey if you hit a wall And you don't know how to proceed and then invest only 15 minutes please and Sometimes to the world for Justin West two hours and they don't listen to the 15 minutes through. You have to say like yeah we'll solve that. No, if you hit the wall, skip it and this wouldn't happen in an office situation because you usually realize after half an hour that the person struggling or the person tends to easier get help um in just slack or micro proteins environment where you'll virtually work. You don't see a person struggling and the that the that the hazard to contact another person like hey can you help me? Hey can you check this? It is, it is of course disturbing them because there you don't know where the person works at, you don't know what they're doing. Sometimes we do like virtual team calls where we like everybody sits in silence and just works that somebody has an idea and starts talking and then we continue with silence. It's just like there are several approaches how we can do it. Um but it is, it is also it gives you a little freedom and happiness and a lot of um there are better just better ways of working in general because you focus more on the actual item or the actual service, somebody created less than personal like empathy or or things like that, which can manipulate your value um in front of a person, so if you really just focus on the items, somebody delivers, this is a great thing about remote work, but it also has some personal struggles.
Speaker Sarah
Absolutely. I also think that the future will be a hybrid model where you say okay, you hear some some certain touchpoints, whether it's two times 3 times a month or less, depending on how the organization set up has been organized, right. But I think, I think having the possibility to work remotely also gives more quality of life if you don't have to, you know, time to, to get to the job or time to you know, whatever do you think? And then I I definitely think that the hyper model will be more in the future. Absolutely. Do you have because you, you said that now showing the people how optimization works in your company, do you have a struggle finding the right people for your positions?
Speaker Sebastian
Yeah, definitely. We are not looking for um classical developers, we're looking for people who think out of the box. So this is, yeah, it is tricky to find people because when, what we experience, we have very simple, like a javascript developer and um he tends to like to code it um that's okay and of course sometimes coding, it is faster and better than doing it, low code. Um but there are still so many things where with this mindset I said like yeah, I can just coat it um where arrows simply appear. So we need a real mixture of somebody who knows how to code but lost no code and low code and has experience on that. And since the the tools are so young, you don't find somebody with seven years experience an entire metal Sappier, they're like Maybe 10 people I know, And I think these 10 people, they're all freelancers and they don't give up their full answer thing.
Speaker Sarah
Yeah, I think the mindset you you mentioned is really important that, I mean it's it's no longer the most important aspect to have the best code. It's rather having the best solution fo the problem. Right.And I think this mindset and needs to shift. All right, so we're coming to an end and what are the project, the next project you have on your list and you want to share with the audience?
Speaker Sebastian
Well, what we're building right now is we're building first marketplace for apps based on local platforms, like for Zappier. Um so you can if you if you find that there is a app which you want to use but it's not on the automation platform and there are a lot of apps which are not on the automation platform and we have that in many client projects, you need that app on the automation platform? So you can hire us to build it and you can literally sell it later on the automation platform and you can also you can use the apps from the platform and just it gives them an entire model step here. Um This is what we're doing and it's also it's a it's a better life right now. Um And the next step is we are doing some we're packing our work into products and we will resell these products um and therefore we are right now on the journey of getting funding because we this really month it's like really cost intensive what we're trying to do. Um And yeah, if this works out these are like the next two things, we will always have the agency part and we will do the internationalization of the agency um since we want to be quality leader in the market. Um but I don't think that we I want to have like 100 employees in an automation agency because right now it is not the market in Germany. Um And since there is no market in Germany now we have to to see how it goes there. But I'm pretty pretty optimistic for the future that automation will be be a good way to go.
Speaker Sarah
Absolutely, absolutely. So what can the audience find more information about it? Can you share some contact information?
Speaker Sebastian
Yeah, sure. Um If they want to know more, they can just go and wemakefuture.com um can they find it?
Speaker Sarah
All right. So we also put everything in the show notes. So is somewhere that was not that fast writing it down. I have one last question and it's a secret question I ask every interview guest. So once the first episode comes out I have to come up with a new one. So if you could start any kind of company without any limitations in terms of money, time personal, what would you start?
Speaker Sebastian
A restaurant.
Speaker Sarah
Which kind of restaurant
Speaker Sebastian
Where you have to reserve your table three months before you can go there.
Speaker Sebastian
What kind of food? And that's actually a good question. Um What we will do is we um will open one day restaurant. Hopefully that only stores like the best local um europe food, like okay, I would love to go to France for like a week and search like on the markets. Okay, what was the best fruit? There was like the best be for whatever they have locally produced and I would love to bring it to the restaurant and create an amazing dish with it. Um And to have like two months of the french food, two months, the spanish food, two months of the italian food. And this is constantly changing and it's something super new. Always. Um It's it's always only menu um and it is of course really luxury. Um and you have like maybe 24 tables um in the restaurant and you have like your 5 um uh like uh how is it called in english? Uh If you're five dishes um and you really can enjoy this going there and I would want to create an experience as we do in automation, I create an experience, we want to create an experience in restaurants maybe one day I don't know but that's what I really would love to do.
Speaker Sarah
That's what I just thought. It kind of relates to your current company so you definitely have a thing and bringing the best service and providing the best service to the clients. All right. Um It was it was a surprise good at this question. Thank you so much for your time and all your insights and um yeah that's it for a moment.
Speaker Sebastian
Thank you very much for your time and yeah. See you soon. Yeah. Yeah. Mhm. Mhm. Thank you. Yeah. Mhm.
Erzähle uns in einem kostenlosen Erstgespräch mehr über dein individuelles Projekt. Wir helfen dir bei den nächsten Schritten und teilen unser Wissen.
Nachricht schreiben